ATEG Archives

April 2009

ATEG@LISTSERV.MIAMIOH.EDU

Options: Use Monospaced Font
Show Text Part by Default
Show All Mail Headers

Message: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Author: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Subject:
From:
"STAHLKE, HERBERT F" <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Thu, 9 Apr 2009 09:04:11 -0400
Content-Type:
text/plain
Parts/Attachments:
text/plain (66 lines)
The tension is between the morphological singular of the indefinite pronoun ending in "-one" or "-body" and the notional plural of the universal quantifier "every-".  This tension is complicated by distance from the referent, so in (1) the formal rule works.

(1) Everyone brought his lunch with him.

In (2a), however, where the second pronoun is farther from the subject, the plural works and the singular, in speech, has that peculiar 3rd person form "em" that goes back to Old English and that is ambiguous as to number.  Since "em" is no onger a written form, written English forces a false choice on the writer.  (2b) illustrates some of the dilemmas of this forced choice.

(2a) Everyone brought his or her lunch with them.
(2b) Everyone brought his or her lunch with him/him or her/her.

In (3), where the pronoun is in a separate clause, notional agreement takes over.

(3) Everyone brought a lunch with them, and they ate it under the trees.

We simply wouldn't say

(4) Everyone brought his lunch with him, and he ate it under the trees.

which begins to sound a bit too much like SI Hayakawa's

(5) Abortion is a decision between the patient and his doctor.

Herb


Herbert F. W. Stahlke, Ph.D.
Emeritus Professor of English
Ball State University
Muncie, IN  47306
[log in to unmask]
________________________________________
From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar [[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Paul E. Doniger [[log in to unmask]]
Sent: April 9, 2009 5:48 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Any member can give their opinion

I find it acceptable in conversation (sometimes), but not in formal writing. My students (high school) have a very hard time with my "conservative" attitude about it. I don't find it easy to read "their," et al, as singular pronouns.

Paul D.

"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction" (_Twelfth Night_ 3.4.127-128).

________________________________
From: DD Farms <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Wednesday, April 8, 2009 10:33:14 PM
Subject: Any member can give their opinion

At 06:15 PM 4/8/2009, O'Sullivan, Brian P wrote:
> I was wondering whether list members find that it is now acceptable (or at least accepted in some circles) to use "they" or "their" as an alternative to constructions like "he or she" or "his or her"--that is, as a gender-neutral third-person pronoun (as in my subject line).

DD: HORROR! I demur. Keep those agreeable agreements amongst the components of the utterance.
To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at:
    http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
and select "Join or leave the list"

Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/
To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list"

Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/

To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at:
     http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
and select "Join or leave the list"

Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/

ATOM RSS1 RSS2