TJ:
Sorry for the slow reply here; I avoided work email over the holidays. I'd certainly call the question use a main-clause example; I committed the old grammarian's sin of focusing on declaratives as the center of the linguistic universe. "Did he ever think of the answer" strikes me as raising more doubts about the person's success than does "Did he think of the answer," so I could at least argue the 'ever' is still adding an irrealis note (although that may be simply a result of the duration element 'ever' also adds).
--- Bill Spruiell
-----Original Message-----
From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar on behalf of T. J. Ray
Sent: Thu 12/23/2010 5:29 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Independent clause or noun phrase
How about "ever" in a question?
Did he ever think of the answer?
tj
On Thursday 12/23/2010 at 3:25 pm, "Spruiell, William C" wrote:
> Dick,
>
> It shows up in some other subordinate constructions, although I
> *think* they all have an element of negation or irrealis status ("I
> wonder when he'll ever finish that" / "If he were ever there, he would
> have known this"); I recall Quirk and Greenbaum having a section on
> this, but I don't have it handy (coffee shop posting). I'm having
> trouble thinking of any examples in a main clause that don't sound
> archaic, but there are candidate expressions "He was ever the
> optimist/pessimist" and "It was ever thus." I suspect a lot of people
> would count those as fossilized, though.
>
> --- Bill Spruiell
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar on behalf of Dick
> Veit
> Sent: Thu 12/23/2010 9:25 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Independent clause or noun phrase
>
> "The last grill brush" is a noun phrase, with an implied "it is." The
> "you
> will ever need" is a relative clause with a null (unstated) relative
> pronoun.
>
> I'd like to hear more from ATEGers about "ever." Am I wrong that it
> occurs
> without a negative only in relative clauses like this? "You won't ever
> need
> a grill brush" is fine, but not *"You will ever need a grill brush."
>
> Dick
>
> On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 8:35 AM, Scott Lavitt <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Happy holidays all.
>>
>> I've been a member of this listserve for years and occasionally seek
>> your
>> collective opinion. Question: how does one parse the following?:
>>
>> The last grill brush you will ever need.
>>
>> I could see this as an independent clause, with "you" as the subj. and
>> "The
>> last grill brush" as the DO, but that doesn't seem right. Seems there
>> is an
>> implied "It is," making the above a noun phrase, and therefore not an
>> independent clause. Thoughts?
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Scott Lavitt
>>
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>>
>
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