Ed:

The 'as' clause in the Henry James sentence is an interesting kind of
relative clause:

    ... which, as many travelers will remember, is seated upon
    the edge of ... a lake

It's definitely relative because its understood direct object is the clause
that it modifies.  That is, "remember" is a transitive verb and what is
being remembered is that the place is seated upon the edge of a lake.
Compare "The place is seated upon the edge of a lake, which many travelers
will remember."  [Some stylists might not recommend having a relative clause
modify an entire clause rather than a noun phrase, but such sentences are
common in our language and so grammatical.  Less jarring: "The place was
built on a lake, which added to its charm."]

The question is: is "as" a relative pronoun in this case?  Good question,
and I'd like to hear what others may think.  It certainly has restrictions
that other relative pronouns, such as "which," don't have.  For one thing,
"which" and "as" aren't interchangeable:

    1. The place is too noisy, which I have often said.  [OK]
    2. The place is too noisy, as I have often said.  [OK]
    3. The place was built on a lake, which added to its charm.  [OK]
    4. *The place was built on a lake, as added to its charm. [not OK]

For another, "which" can introduce a relative clause that modifies either a
noun phrase ("ATEG, which has a mailing list") or a complete clause
(examples 1 and 3 above), but "as" can only introduce a relative clause that
modifies another clause (example 2 above).

Third, "which" commonly acts either as underlying subject (example 3 above)
or underlying object (example 1) of a relative clause.  "As" works when the
understood element is an object ("as I have said," "as you will remember")
but not always when the underlying element is the subject (*"as amazed me").
However, there are cases where it does occur ("as is commonly assumed").

So is it a relative pronoun in the James sentence?

Dick Veit


-----Original Message-----
From: EDWARD VAVRA <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Friday, July 02, 1999 3:33 PM
Subject: Another Grammatical Question


     I have been putting a grammar course on-line, with answer keys, and I'm
wondering how members of ATEG would explain "as many travelers will
remember" in the following sentence from the opening paragraph of James'
"Daisy Miller":

There are, indeed, many hotels, for the entertainment of tourists is the
business of  the place, which, as many travelers will remember, is seated
upon the edge of a remarkably blue lake--a lake that it behooves every
tourist to visit.

You might also want to comment on the function of the "for" clause. I will
probably include some of your comments as notes ― disagreements :) ― to my
explanation.

Thanks,
Ed