She does, but now that we've addressed the netiquette question, we might consider getting back to the reason why Brock posted the exchange in the first place. When I read through the entire discussion today, I got the feeling of finding myself in a strange city where familiar things suddenly looked slightly out of kilter. Seeing the teaching of grammar from the point of view of concerned, intelligent, sometimes ill-informed but unquestionably canny teachers, I see at least the following things: a perception of what grammar is that differs from that shared by most of us who teach grammar to teachers, an assumed body of research and of authorities on grammar that is different from what I have seen discussed elsewhere, a serious grappling with WHY one might teach grammar and, whatever one's reasons, how that question is related to WHAT one teaches. These are sensibilities that I find myself needing exposure as our faculty consider how to train teachers to work with the new Indiana language arts standards, standards that demand a knowledge of grammar that few of my undergraduate English majors have attained. I don't plan on teaching methods for teaching grammar. My role is content. We have methods people, and we pretty obviously have to work with them as well, because they're much closer to the middle school teacher's sensibilities than I am, and they have more to say than they realize about what future language arts teachers need to know. This is the discussion I'd like to see carried on in conjunction with participants from the middle school list. Herb Stahlke <<< [log in to unmask] 12/20 5:00p >>> Gretchen has *excellent* points for all of us... Judy At 03:57 PM 12/20/00 -0500, you wrote: >Dear listserv members, > Getchen has good points, and I regret forwarding the NCTE discussion >impulsively. I was sure members would find it interesting, as they have, >but the listservs do create a semi-public/semi-private space where the rules >are fluid and common sense and courtesy are important. Gretchen's >suggestion of an invitation would certainly have been a preferable route. >My apologies to the NCTE members involved. > >Brock Haussamen > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gretchen Lee [mailto:[log in to unmask]] >Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 3:15 PM >To: [log in to unmask] >Subject: Re: NCTE Middle level grammar talk, Pt. 2 > > >In a message dated 12/20/2000 11:49:40 AM Pacific Standard Time, >[log in to unmask] writes:<< but if I am, the netiquette is > frequently violated. >> > >Judy, > >What I'm objecting to here is a missed opportunity. There has been an >interesting discussion of grammar on NCTE (to which I belong). Four or five >teachers have posted looking for information, and Nancy Patterson was the >main respondent, although Candy Lindquist and Jerome also contributed >valuable posts. Brock then quotes Nancy here without asking/telling her, >and >he invites comment from the ATEG list. > >What if he had written to the NCTE list and Nancy INVITING her and all the >other posters who were interested in the grammar discussion to come on over >to ATEG for a discussion with a lot of people who are fascinated with >grammar? > >I keep hearing that ATEG wants more teachers of hs/ms/elementary to join in >the discussion. Wouldn't an invitation rather than an ambush (sorry - I >think it's rude, and I'm not alone!) have contributed more to the general >discussion of grammar? > >It just leaves a bad taste in my mouth when someone who is very accessible >(and I know Nancy personally - don't always agree with her, but she is >always >willing to discuss her views-) has her words reposted out of the context of >a >long discussion without a chance to clarify or defend her view point. > >I originally joined ATEG because of Nancy (and Candy). I wanted to see what >the "other side" had to say, if indeed ATEG was in opposition to her views. >I stayed because of the discussion. How many others would do the same if >invited? > >Gretchen in San Jose >[log in to unmask] > >To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface >at: > http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html >and select "Join or leave the list" > >Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ > >To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: > http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html >and select "Join or leave the list" > >Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ > To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/