At 09:24 AM 7/20/01 -0500, you wrote: >Also, a really funny thing to say (because not many people say it correctly): >"Are these the papers you need me to grade?" >"Yes, these are they." For some reason, "I" sounds so much more elegant, sophisticated, and proper than "me." Unfortunately, not only is it incorrect, but for those who recognize the error, it also sounds pompous. For me, however, the most interesting aspect of your post was the "Yes, these are they" construction. I'm fascinated by how the most awkward constructions are actually required based on how you start a sentence. As soon as the dreaded "these" is used to start the sentence, it only goes downhill from there into a quagmire of muddy usage. But here is a good example of when not to use "these," but start with the actual subject "they." "Yes, they are" would be preferred usage. My question - is there a technique that anyone uses to teach when to use "This is" and "These/Those are" as introductions, and when to use the actual subject instead? Geoff Layton PS: For all those who missed the "convention" at Park - too bad! It was great. To Jeff and Bob - thank you! To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/