Johanna, I've run into this problem too. I used to do summer workshops for language arts teachers and do some consulting in the schools, and what we face there is a powerful body of very damaging cultural mythology that is cultivated among people that school boards are answerable to. This is something we discussed a couple of years ago when Craig introduced the NPG agenda and we were all thinking about not just what it should be but how it might be implemented. There was discussion then that we had to make inroads into radio and TV talk shows, into popular magazines, onto music shows, anywhere where we could find an audience for the debate that must ensue. I'm not at all dismayed at the debate that has ensued among us; this is precisely the debate we are going to have to initiate publicly, and we're getting some very good practice. My Language and Society students have reacted much as yours have, and we talk about the context they'll be working in. They're aware that their culture has a firm mindset that's opposed to what they're coming to realize. They don't know how to confront it, and I tell them that for the most part they're going to be obligated to follow the lead and the standards of the school they work in. But they can communicate their attitude towards language variation when they're working with the children they teach. They can also influence fellow teachers and parents. But they and we are not in a short time going to reverse generations of prejudice and of prejudiced literature on language in a tradition that goes back to before the eighteenth century. We can, however, hope to nudge our culture in the right direction, and hope that some of our students will be influential. But we also need for NPG to have a public voice. CCCC and NCTE are good places to start, and people like Craig and Martha do a great job, and if we can influence NCTE policy statements we'll get even farther. But we have think beyond our professional organizations. We also need to look more closely at the British model that Dick Hudson has been involved with. Herb Herb, It's good that a lot of future teachers are being required to take linguistics and language-and-society classes, but there is a big disconnect once they get out of college and into schools. Their grammar-teaching materials take no account of dialect differences whatever (leastways not those published for use in CA), and simply state that one does something this or that way, period. So, "verbs must agree with their subjects", and only one way of doing this is presented. There is no qualification "This is how verbs agree with their subjects in _standard_ English". The only mention of dialect I have found in the majority of K-12 teaching materials relates it to literature, usually refers merely to "groups" or just regions, and treats it as a way of making literature more "colorful" or a character more "authentic". (One high-school book, I think it is the senior-level text, and I think the publisher is Prentice-Hall, has a section in each unit on language, including the history of the language and dialect variation, etc. I think it was written by John Algeo. It's the only linguistically-informed patch I've seen in any of the materials CA has approved (and I have looked at them all). However, the grammar materials that go with the book are the usual prescriptive stuff.) And, as I have said before, numerous grammar points are covered with the sole purpose in mind of correcting the language habits of children who speak nonstandard English. This is the only reason to have lessons about double negatives, "hisself", irregular verbs, and so on in these materials. They are treated as mistakes (often using that very word), not as alternative ways of doing things in various communities of speakers. When these new teachers get into the schools, they will have as their judges and superiors people who have not had the education about dialect and language that they have had. Those who care about grammar at all will be those who believe in what the textbooks teach. To what extent will the new teachers be able to buck the system? The Ebonics controversy showed just how ignorant of these issues most Americans are. Now we have the added pressure of No Child Left Behind, standardized testing, and rabid anti-bilingual movements. Many of my students remark on how eye-opening my lectures on dialect prejudice are, and many also tell me how, since the lectures and readings, they have arguments with those of their friends and family who correct other people's grammar all the time. A number also often tell me that they used to correct other people all the time, but now realize how snobbish and offensive that is. But for them to play a role in reforming grammar instruction, they will need both materials and support. A new teacher is overwhelmed enough with the teaching load, the number of students, the lesson planning, grading student work, etc., without having to both create supplemental grammar materials _and_ have arguments with the head of the English department about how to teach grammar. This is why I keep saying that we have to get the attention of the powers that be by implementing reformed practices wherever we can and demonstrating their effectiveness through _higher test scores_. The Ebonics flap taught us that the authorities are not going to listen to linguists just on the merits of the facts linguistic science has piled up. We have to find other windows, other ways in. Most teachers love their kids and want them to succeed, and most now realize that prejudice is a form of disadvantage. They need to be made aware of the fact that language-based prejudice is built into the current grammar curriculum, then be given ideas and materials for doing it better. We need a sort of ten-point PR plan. It is very important for us to work with practicing teachers as well as trainees. Something I plan to do this coming school year is to write to our state's Superintendent of Education (who used to be a state representative from my district) about the possibility of closing the achievement gap for African American kids partly through introducing a different way of handling language arts for them. I'm going to bug him until he agrees to talk with me about it, and I'm going to tell him about the various places this is being done. Dr. Johanna Rubba, Associate Professor, Linguistics Linguistics Minor Advisor English Department California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo E-mail: [log in to unmask] Tel.: 805.756.2184 Dept. Ofc. Tel.: 805.756.2596 Dept. Fax: 805.756.6374 URL: http://www.cla.calpoly.edu/~jrubba To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/