Martha,
Thanks for taking the time to write a clear and thoughtful discussion of
the part-of-speech/lexical category problem. As I recall from earlier
threads on this subject, we were not only unable to agree on a set of
categories; we were unable to agree on what to call such categories or
what criteria to use in determining them. I don't like "parts of
speech" either, with it's assumed preceding number word "eight".
Greenbaum suggests eleven categories, but he then points to several
words that don't fit into any category.
Herb
From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Martha Kolln
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 6:59 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Part of speech query
Ronald, Johanna, Herb, and all:
I think that one problem with terminology is the term "parts of speech."
(I prefer to discuss "word classes" rather than "parts of speech."
After all, we could also identify prepositional phrases and subjects and
predicates as "parts of speech.") Except for the terms "gerund" and
"participle," the Warriner type of traditional school grammar ignores
the concept of function in its descriptions. For example, a noun that
modifies a noun headword (the garbage can, the college professor, the
computer problem) is labeled an adjective; a noun modifying a verb (I
walked home; He's coming Monday) will be called an adverb.
But considering both form and function, we would describe the noun
modifiers as nouns functioning adjectivally; the verb modifiers as nouns
functioning adverbially. The word class is one thing; its function
another.
(This problem also shows up in certain traditional test items, when
students are asked to "underline the nouns." Are they looking for
nominals only? Or do nouns functioning as adjectives and adverbs also
require the underline? The same question applies to verb underlining.
We need those -al terms!)
In calling my and his and her determiners, we are discussing their
function. In form, I maintain that they are pronouns. Pronouns should
not be defined according to their function, any more than adjectives
should! And certainly, in teaching school grammar, I would advocate
describing the whole system of personal pronouns: subjective, objective,
and possessive forms. The alternate possessive forms (mine, his, hers,
theirs) function when the noun headword is missing. And, by the way, a
pronoun can, indeed, take the place of a noun phrase--when that noun
phrase is functioning as a determiner: my big sister's cat = her cat.
The problem with the traditional definition of "pronoun" is that the
term "nominal" is not in the traditional vocabulary. A pronoun takes
the place, not of a noun or even a noun phrase, but of a nominal--no
matter what its form: Exercising regularly is vital to our health = It
is vital to our health.
I would mention, too, that I consider this, that, these, and those
pronouns: i.e., demonstrative pronouns. They, too, take the place of
nominals. And, unlike most personal pronouns, they have no alternative
form when the head is missing. "I have have read all of these books; I
have read all of these." May descriptions of grammar call them
"demonstrative adjectives." (Let's save the term adjective for those
words that, for the most part, fit the formal description.)
I think it's very useful in teaching the concept of "determiner," to
remind students that when they use a pronoun, especially this or that,
without its headword, ambiguity often occurs: The "antecedent" problem
can sometimes be explained better as a "lack of headword" problem.
One more thought: I consider both 'determiner" and "qualifier" as the
names of word classes--a big, and important, difference from traditional
grammar, with its limited "eight parts of speech." But in both cases, I
recognize that the terms straddle the line between form and function.
On the one hand, articles are straightforward determiners; however,
other word classes, such as possessive pronouns, also function as
determiners, as do pronouns of various subclasses. In other words, both
of these word classes--nouns and pronouns--also function as determiners.
In the case of "qualifier," we do have very, the quintessential
qualifier;and we have a few others, like so and rather, that are usually
qualifiers. But then there are all those -ly adverbs that can function
as qualifiers: absolutely true! So they're not really "closed classes,"
as conjunctions and prepositions and auxiliaries are. But I think it's
still useful to include "determiners" and "qualifiers" as "structure"
classes, rather than "form" classes--with that caveat--simply to make
clear the special nature of nouns, verbs, adjectives, and adverbs.
Martha
We've had some interesting discussions of Part of Speech on this
list,
and, while we don't all agree as to which ones and how many
English
grammar needs, there is broad agreement that they are defined on
morphological and syntactic grounds, as well as semantic.
School
grammars tend to offer much more notional classification
reflecting the
eight pars orationis of the Greco-Latin grammatical tradition.
I've used the "possessive pronoun" terminology consistently
throughout
my career, both as a linguist and as a grammar teacher. The
words
simply do not belong to the same lexical class (part of speech).
English adjectives may take the suffixes -er and -est, are
preceded by
number words and determiners (articles, demonstratives,
possessive
pronouns), and may also be predicative without changing form.
Possessive pronouns, on the other hand, precede number words and
adjectives, are uninflectable except in that they are the
diachronic
product of inflecting a pronoun root, and may change form to be
predicative (mine, (thine,) hers, ours, yours, theirs). "His"
and "its"
don't show this inflection. And, of course, pronouns a closed
class of
function words while adjectives are an open class of content
words.
The standard reference grammars listed below pretty much agree
on this
treatment. I've used the Greenbaum as a text a number of times.
School
grammars tend to be more influenced by grammatical traditions.
Some standard reference grammars:
Biber, Douglas; Stig Johansson, Geoffrey Leech, Susan Conrad,
and Edward
Finegan. 1999. Longman Grammar of Spoken and Written English.
London:
Pearson ESL.
Greenbaum, Sidney. 1996. The Oxford English grammar. New
York:
Oxford University Press.
Huddleston, Rodney D., and Geoffrey K. Pullum. 2002. The
Cambridge
Grammar of the English Language. London: Cambridge University
Press.
Quirk, Randolph; Sidney Greenbaum, Geoffrey Leech, and Jan
Svartvik.
1985A Comprehensive Grammar of the English Language. London:
Longman.
For historical purposes, I go to Jespersen's seven volume A
Modern
English Grammar on Historical Principles, but modern reference
grammars
agree quite extensively with his grammatical analyses.
In short, I agree with Swan.
Herb
This may sound elementary but is anyone using a reference
grammar which
classifies 'my', 'your', 'her' etc. as 'possessive pronouns' and
not as
'possessive adjectives'?.
For example, Thomson and Martinet (A Practical English Grammar -
page
75)
classifies them as possessive adjectives.
On the other hand, Michael Swan's Practical English Usage (p.
416)
classifies them as possessive pronouns and states 'They are not
adjectives
though they are sometimes called 'possessive adjectives' in
older
grammars
and dictionaries'.
Is there anyone on the List who follows Swan's classification?
Ron Sheen
To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web
interface at:
http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
and select "Join or leave the list"
Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/
To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web
interface at:
http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
and select "Join or leave the list"
Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/
To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web
interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select
"Join or leave the list"
Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/
To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at:
http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
and select "Join or leave the list"
Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/