Brad Johnston <[log in to unmask]> wrote: George bush has been president for 7 years (and still is). After he's gone, George Bush was president for 8 years. I should have said in here: "George Bush IS president", is a sentence. "George Bush WAS president", is a sentence. "George Bush had been president", is not a sentence. It cannot stand alone. It's a "fragment". If you have a better word than "fragment", I can live with it. If you think "George Bush had been president", is a sentence, someone tell me what it means. .brad.17feb08. Craig Hancock <[log in to unmask]> wrote: I have a hard time with the implication that perfect aspect does no work. Gorge Bush is President for seven years. George Bush was President for seven years. George Bush has been President for seven years. For the most part, the third one sounds right to me (in the context of our current situation) because it conveys the sense of a continuing reality. It sounds right because there's a form/meaning match. We can do that a number of ways (He is in the final year of a second four year term),but "taste">leaves me uncomfortable. I don't think you are in that camp, but most people believe grammar is about what's correct or what's tasteful, and that's one reason it's out of favor. What does perfect aspect do? Don't we need to define that in functional terms? --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/