I thought so, too, Paul-but is "you" the subject of the clause "if you
please," where "you" is the subject of the verb "please" (meaning, in this
case, "if you wish/desire") OR is "you" the subject of the passive
construction "if you are pleased [to respond]" OR is "pleased" a
subject-complement adjective describing "you"? In all three cases, "you" is
the subject, but the whole question led me to think about the rest of the
constructions.

 

These are the sentences that make class discussions fun and informative.

 

 

Nancy L. Tuten, PhD

Professor of English

Director of the Writing-across-the-Curriculum Program

Columbia College

Columbia, South Carolina

 <mailto:[log in to unmask]> [log in to unmask]

803-786-3706

 

 

  _____  

From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Paul E. Doniger
Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 6:25 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: RSVP

 

I understand that the 'you' may be considered an object, but it seems more
to me like the subject of an eliptical construction: "If you please to do
(think?) so." Is there any evidence for something like this being the case?

 

Paul D.

 

----- Original Message ----
From: "STAHLKE, HERBERT F" <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 2:24:29 PM
Subject: Re: RSVP

This strikes me as one of those fossilized forms, like "methinks" or
"meseems," that now seem archaic.  "If you please," while not so archaic,
has a very formal feel to it.  All the OED says of it is 

 

 b. To be pleased, to like; to have the will or desire; to have the
inclination or disposition; to think proper; to choose. Chiefly Sc.in
earlier use.
  Equivalent in sense to the passive in sense 4b.
  Chiefly used in constructions where the desirable action or state is
implied or understood; now rarely with this expressed by an infinitive
clause.

 

I don't think the "you" is like the "me," though, an archaic preverbal
indirect object.  Rather, as the OED indicates, the active has taken on the
meaning of the passive.

 

Herb

 

From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Scott
Sent: 2008-04-27 10:24
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: RSVP

 

Enclosed is a comment extracted from another list.  I would appreciate the
comments of other grammarians on the two questions posed.

 

1.  (But do you really think "you" in phrases like "if you please" can be
called a direct object?  This construction is at least 500 years old. 

2.  (Would "if you like" be the same?)

 

Scott Catledge

Professor Emeritus

history & languages

 

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