Bruce,

 

I agree that the whole framework for dealing with comparatives and pronoun case is one of those attempts to foist logic onto language; it’s historically tied  to attempts to create a strong distinction between conjunctions and prepositions (if you’ve decided that the crucial distinction is that conjunctions connect equivalent structures whereas prepositions don’t, and you’ve decided that ‘than’ is a conjunction, you’ve painted yourself into a corner where you have to use an ellipsis argument).  It’s all artificial.

 

I find myself wanting to treat “other than” as unit distinct from “separated” versions – that is, “x other than y” seems different from “another x than y.” My instinct is to go with “Anyone other than me gave her second looks,” probably because I’m viewing “other than” as equivalent to “except for.” It’s one of those classic situations in which the answer is based on some analogy, and there’s no real way to figure out which out of a set of possible analogies is the “right” one…other than consensus. And I don’t know the consensus on this one (or even if there is one to begin with). 

 

Bill Spruiell

Dept. of English

Central Michigan University

 

From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bruce Despain
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2008 10:18 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Than vs. other than

 

Bill,

 

I wonder whether this whole set up is some conspiracy by grammarians who need everything to be logical.  I suspect that it was historically always objective, but it is possible to set some of these comparative forms in a position where logic requires them to take a subject form:

 

     John rather than I gave Mary second looks.

     Anyone other than I gave her second looks.

 

The first form is from a disused adverb "rath" and the second structures parallel to "else."  Maybe Herb can shed some light on the history of these comparatives.  Your first examples use the comparative of "many" (or "much") which appears before a noun.  This position can also be taken by "other" but its complement in the subjective is awkward, and its proleptic clausal form doesn't help.

 

     ?John talked to another woman than I [talked to].
     ? John talked to another woman than [he talked to] me.

 

Bruce


>>> "Spruiell, William C" <[log in to unmask]> 04/10/08 3:21 PM >>>

 

Someone asked me today whether one should use “I” or “me” after “other than.” Now, I know the standard answer for when you have just “than” – fill in the words that you think are elided to get the right pronoun:

 

                John gave Mary more books than I [gave Mary].

                John gave Mary more books than [he gave] me.

 

But…I can’t make ellipsis work with “other than”:

 

                *Don’t talk to anyone other than [you talk to] me.

 

If I used “but” instead of “other than,” I’d class that “but” as a preposition – it seems to be introducing a noun phrase, not a clause with elliptical bits -- so that’s the route I went with “other than.”  Does that seem reasonable? Garner’s dictionary of usage had nothing on that particular point.

 

Thanks in advance – 

 

Bill Spruiell

To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" 

Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ 

________________________________

NOTICE: This email message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message.