Cynthia,
I always put the particle on the line with the verb. I thought that when a
word that us usually a preposition functions as a particle, then we don't
have a prepositional phrase at all (because we don't really have a
preposition). I will be interested to see if I've been teaching this idea
correctly or not, but I teach my students that a verb phrase that includes a
particle would mean something entirely different without the particle and
that a one-word verb can usually replace the verb phrase.
For example, "to turn off" is an entirely different action than "to turn,"
and "to turn off" can be replaced by "to extinguish."
Once we have applied those tests and determined that we have a particle, I
no longer call it a preposition. The word that would have been the object of
the preposition is now the direct object.
Eagerly awaiting the others' feedback . . .
Nancy
Nancy L. Tuten, PhD
Professor of English
Director of the Writing-across-the-Curriculum Program
Columbia College
Columbia, South Carolina
<mailto:[log in to unmask]> [log in to unmask]
803-786-3706
From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Cynthia Baird
Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2008 10:11 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Prepositional Phrases as Subject Complements
This might be a little off topic, but Bill's response brought to mind
something that I have always struggled with.
In traditional high school sentence diagramming, how does one diagram a
prepositional phrase following verbs like "put" or "turn" which are always
followed with what I was taught are verb particles. For example, Turn
up/off the radio. or Turn off the lights. or She put on her clothes. I
don't see the prepositional phrase as being truly adverbial, but that's
always how high school textbooks diagram them. Is there a way to diagram a
verb particle? Can the particle be part of the verb followed by a direct
object (radio, clothes, etc.)?
thanks!
--- On Mon, 5/19/08, Spruiell, William C <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
From: Spruiell, William C <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Prepositional Phrases as Subject Complements
To: [log in to unmask]
Date: Monday, May 19, 2008, 11:12 AM
The traditional approach of ruling out prepositional phrases as subject
complements is partly, I think, a relic of the "word-based" focus of pretty
much all grammar up until the twentieth century. That is, an actual "object"
or "complement" had to be a word - and in older systems a "substantive."
That category could include nouns and adjectives, so adjectival subject
complements were no problem. With prepositional phrases, though, the nominal
part was considered to be the object of the preposition, and it could not
simultaneously be the object of a preposition *and* the complement of a
verb. Saying that the PP as a whole is the complement, rather than the NP
inside it, solves the problem nicely, but the traditional system never quite
made it that far with subject complements, although it did with (for
example) acknowledging noun clauses as direct objects.
I can't see much of an argument other than tradition for ruling out PPs as
SCs. Yes, there are semantic limitations on them, but that's true of regular
SCs as well. It's difficult to set up a situation in which "My cat is
tangential" or "The chief of staff is the twelfth century" work very well.
Locational PPs work well primarily as SCs to..well, locations. Acknowledging
PPs as complements also lets you deal more systematically with the verb
"put," since otherwise you're stuck explaining why that "adverbial PP" is
not only mandatory, but hard to move.
Bill Spruiell
Dept. of English
Central Michigan University
From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Martha Kolln
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 4:43 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Prepositional Phrases as Subject Complements
I certainly agree, Dick, that these adverbials have limitations. Time
adverbials are limited, I suspect, to events.
Martha
Martha,
We probably should make a distinction between time/place adverbials that are
complementary (describing the subject) and those that are non-complementary
(purely adverbial, describing the predicate). For example, in your sentence
"The car is here now," "here" is complementary but "now" is not. We can say
"The car is here," but we can't say "The car is now."
Likewise the sentence "Emma was at the beach after final exams" allow us to
say "Emma was at the beach," but it doesn't allow us to say "Emma was after
final exams." "At the beach" is an adverbial that complements the subject
(answers "Where was Emma?). "After final exams" is a non-complementary
adverbial (answers "When was Emma at the beach?" rather than "When was
Emma?").
Dick
________________________________
Richard Veit
Department of English
University of North Carolina Wilmington
_____
From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Martha Kolln
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 2:58 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Prepositional Phrases as Subject Complements
Hi Patty,
In traditional grammar, be is classified as a linking verb. That system
leaves out sentences like Peter's second one, "Deb was in her car," where
what follows be is an adverbial.
This is a pattern that , in my grammar book, I identify as "NP be
ADV/TP"--where be is followed by an adverbial of time or place, rather than
by a subject complement. Such adverbials are often prepositional phrases.
Here are some other examples:
Deb was there.
The car is here now.
The party will be tomorrow.
The election was on Tuesday.
These "completers" of the predicate don't describe or rename the subject, as
Peter's first example does. "Cornelia was in a bad mood" is another way of
saying "Cornelia was cranky." I suppose you could call the adverbial
completers complements, but they aren't subject complements as adjectivals
and nominals are.
And note too that the adverbials that complete be sentences are limited to
time or place; adverbials of manner, for example, don't work here. It's not
that we can't say "Deb was quickly"--it's just that we don't.
Martha
Sincere question, here:
Would it be OK/accurate to say that, in the first sentence, "in a bad mood"
is a prepositional phrase functioning adjectivally, where in the second
sentence, "in her car" is more of an adverbial function?
Tell the truth, I'm not sure how to classify "location" as a subject
complement.
My thinking is: how would I explain this to students, who might not have had
the exposure to this grammar list?
-patty
-----Original Message-----
From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Peter Adams
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 11:56 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Prepositional Phrases as Subject Complements
How would you categorize the prep phrase, "in a bad mood," in a
sentence like the following?
Cornelia was in a bad mood.
How about the prep phrase "in her car" in the following sentence?
Deb was in her car.
Peter Adams
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