Craig, This raises the question of category differences between adpositions and adverbs. I think English has been moving towards having postpositions, as your examples, and ago, suggest. But the adverb/adposition distinction is less than clear. Herb -----Original Message----- From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Craig Hancock Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:19 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Adverbs? I would also wonder about "before" and "after" and "past" in "many years before," "many years after," and "many years past." Are these all "postpositions"? Craig On 10/6/2010 10:26 AM, Katz, Seth wrote: > So, Herb, would a more contemporary paraphrase of "ago" (the used-to-be participle) in a phrase like "many years ago" be something like "many years that have gone"? > > Seth > > Dr. Seth Katz > Assistant Professor > Department of English > Bradley University > > ________________________________ > > From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar on behalf of Stahlke, Herbert F.W. > Sent: Tue 10/5/2010 9:49 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: Adverbs? > > > > I agree with Dick's analysis. Historically "ago" is a shortening of an older past participle of "go," "agone" The prefix a- has about as complex and ancestry and etymology as anything in English, but a lot of words that have an a- prefix are used only postnominally or predicatively. We can't say "an awake dog" or "an alive fish," although other a- words like "alert" and "ashamed" can be attributive. Because "ago" has lost all participial traces but remains postnominal, it has become what Dick called it, a postposition. "Alert," by the way, is not etymologically one of the a- prefix words. It was borrowed from French in something close to its current form and would break down in French etymology to al+ert. It first appears in English in 1598 where it is used predicatively. The first attributive usage appears in 1712. > > > > Herb > > From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar > [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Dick Veit > Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 6:09 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: Adverbs? > > > > "Forty years ago" seems to function much like a prepositional phrase, but with "ago" as a postposition rather than a preposition. > > Thanks for posing this question, Janet. I look forward to being enlightened by responses from others. > > Dick > > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Castilleja, Janet<[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > Hello > > How do you usually analyze a structure like this: Our old beach house, which was built forty years ago, has now vanished. What do you do with 'forty years ago'? I learned it as a noun phrase functioning as an adverb, but I'm not sure that's the best description, especially when working with students. > > Thanks! > > Janet > > To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: > http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html > and select "Join or leave the list" > > Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ > > > To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" > > Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ > > To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" > > Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ > > > To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: > http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html > and select "Join or leave the list" > > Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ > > To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/ To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/