From: Eduard Hanganu <[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Fri, December 24, 2010 7:49:52 AM Subject: Re: Despain, Mastering the Challenge >> Brad, >> I know what the past perfect is, Fine. Let's see it. >> and I understand its value on the time axis. Fine. Let's see it. >> I use it in a couple of languages You haven't yet demonstrated it in English >> I can also define it, Fine. Let's see it. >> but what difference would it make to you? Lots, Eduard. You think I have nothing better to do than grapple with a defensive grammarian? Hardly. >> You are not a believer. I believe in the obvious results of a 10-year inquiry into the nature and extent of the misuse of 'had' in contemporary English. >> I am not peevish. Resipsa Loquitur. >> I am just tired of your endless repetitions of the same ignorant affirmations >>on the tenses in English. If you're tired, hit the 'delete' button. I'll miss you. You're interesting and good fun until you get peevish. >> You need to do a little reading before you can make some relevant >conversation. I have read more than you will ever read on the subject. >> Quirk and Comrie's books are not diversions from the topic. They contain >>information that might improve your understanding of the English tenses. Fine. Let's see it ... or direct me to page numbers or sections. I stand by "Quirk won't help you." >> Happy Holidays! >> Eduard "No offense intended" .brad.24dec10. ----- Original Message ----- From: Brad Johnston <[log in to unmask]> Date: Thursday, December 23, 2010 20:29 Subject: Re: Despain, Mastering the Challenge To: [log in to unmask] > Eduard is peevish because I asked him, after a number of > pleasant and > interesting exchanges, to define the past perfect. He can't do > it. He doesn't > know what it is. That makes him cross. (If you can do > it, Eduard, do it. Don't > rant at me. Just do it.) > > I then asked him to ask each person in one of his classes to > send me a > definition, without him explaining what it is. I don't want to > read 30 > variations on what he tells them. Make it open book. Let them > look it up if they > want. > > He won't do that either, so he sends out a spleen-gram, and he > drops Quirk's > name as a smoke screen but Quirk won't help him. How's that for > a definitive > statement? Quirk won't help. > > Please prove me wrong, Eduard. Maybe the others will help you. > Who has Quirk > handy? > > .brad.23dec10. > > > ________________________________ > From: Eduard Hanganu <[log in to unmask]> > To: [log in to unmask] > Sent: Wed, December 22, 2010 7:41:35 AM > Subject: Re: Bruce Despain, Mastering the Challenge > > > Brad, > > This is my example: > > "I HAD BEEN READING [ Past Perfect Tense Progressive Aspect] > your rumblings for > too long before I DECIDED [ Absolute Simple Past Tense ] > that they were not > worth my time." > > This is a proper use of the Progressive Past Perfect Tense > (Aspect) and of the > (Absolute) Simple Past Tense on the time axis. See Quirk et al. > in "A > Comprehensive Grammar of the English Language," and Comrie in > "Aspect." > > > > Eduard > > > > To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at: http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html and select "Join or leave the list" Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/