In response to Gordon Carmichael's query: I'm sure this has a very interesting answer in detailed ilnguistics, but who wants to get that detailed? What follows is pretty much off the top of my head. I know the definite article can be used for generics (as in 'The horse was domesticated during the Stone Age' = 'Horses were domesticated during the stone age"), and this is what allows 'the making of a cake is fun'. But I think it is a good rule of thumb to avoid using the definite article if you want to talk about the activity as a generic. I would recommend 'Making a cake is fun' or 'Cake-making is fun' over 'the making of a cake is fun'. The def. article suggests definiteness, so a def. art. with a gerund sounds best when a specific or delimited activity is being named. THat's why 'the swimming in Lake Cahoogaloosa is fun' sounds better (if others share my intuition) than 'the swimming in a pool is fun'; in the latter, 'a pool' is an indefinite generic. In cases where the gerund names a specific event, it seems that the def. art. is actually required, as in 'the shooting of the child was a heinous crime'. I would ask my ESL students to be satisfied with the rule of thumb as outlined above, and consider it just that: a rule of thumb. If they want more detail, refer them to Quirk, Greenbaum, Leech & Svartvik's compendious grammar of English! And tell them to be on the lookout for examples of the usage in question in written texts and bring them in for discussion -- let _them_ be the linguists, and find the rule inductively. I think we need to temper their desire for 'the absolute rule' somewhat -- so much of language IS conventional usage, and so many rules are subtle like this one. I wonder how many other ATEGers share my intutions on this particular item. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Johanna Rubba Assistant Professor, Linguistics ~ English Department, California Polytechnic State University ~ San Luis Obispo, CA 93407 ~ Tel. (805)-756-2184 Fax: (805)-756-6374 ~ E-mail: [log in to unmask] ~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~