ATEG Archives

May 2005

ATEG@LISTSERV.MIAMIOH.EDU

Options: Use Monospaced Font
Show Text Part by Default
Show All Mail Headers

Message: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]
Author: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Subject:
From:
Craig Hancock <[log in to unmask]>
Reply To:
Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Mon, 16 May 2005 09:24:57 -0400
Content-Type:
text/plain
Parts/Attachments:
text/plain (126 lines)
Paul,
    These are very important questions.  We also need to worry about the
ethics of testing a "rule" as prescriptive when it has never been
taught as a prescriptive rule to anybody taking the test. Do we want
to test the knowledge students actually have?  Their unconscious
intuitive "feel" for the language, which may or may not coincide with
the unconscious intuitive feel of the test maker? What is the
rationale for asking this question?
    How about "Are both "on" and "to" typical as heads of prepositional
phrases that might follow "damage" as a complement?" How many of the
test takers (or test makers) would be able to answer that question?
Why don't we teach that if it is deemed inmportant?
    Our task, I THINK, is to convince these people that knowledge of
grammar is highly important, and that we shouldn't let someone's
future be determined by a test that has no connection to an actual
curriculum. We shouldn't judge people by their language habits and
their ability to intuit some habits as acceptable, especially habits
that seem exotic or arcane.
    Perhaps the habits of the grade givers in college will coincide with
the habits of those screened by these tests?  Is that what passes
these days for predictive testing?
    I think the emporer here is not just without clothes, but woefully
pudgy and painful to look at.

Craig


Herb is right on the money as usual!
>
> How do we inform the SAT test makers that they need to be less
> prescriptive about this sort of thing and that questions like these do no
> provide any useful information to their target audiences? Would they even
> listen?
>
> Paul
>
> "Stahlke, Herbert F.W." <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Paul,
>
> The question assumes that the two prepositions are not interchangeable at
> all: "to" is right and "on" is wrong. What the question misses is that
> choice of preposition depends on meaning. "Damage to the plants" and
> "damage on the plants" don't mean the same thing. This is, unfortunately,
> typical of prescription judgments, that they assume we all get the same
> meaning out of a text, and this is clearly not the case. A careful writer
> will choose the preposition with care and won't default to a single
> constant choice.
>
> Herb
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar on behalf of PAUL E.
> DONIGER
> Sent: Fri 5/13/2005 8:37 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: more on the SAT
>
> SAT publishes a "Question of the Day" on its web pge; here is today's
> question:
>
> The following sentence contains either a single error or no error at all.
> If the sentence contains an error, select the one underlined part that
> must be changed to make the sentence correct. If the sentence contains no
> error, select choice E.
>
>
>
>
> Whereas the caterpillars of most butterfliesA are harmless, moth
> caterpillars causeB an enormous amount of damage onC Dplants, forest and
> shade trees, clothing, and household goods. No error E
>
>
>
> [input] (A)
> [input] (B)
> [input] (C)
> [input] (D)
> [input] (E)
>
> What would you answer? They say that the answer is "D" because the
> caterpillar can cause damage 'to' something but not 'on' something. It
> seems to me to be a very fussy answer (and if it is so rigid, then isn't
> the question skewed and unfair?). The damage is ON the plants and was
> caused by the caterpillars, so why can't 'on' be as good as 'to' (or at
> least an acceptable response?)?
>
> Curiously yours,
>
> Paul D.
>
>
> "If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable
> fiction" (_Twelfth Night_ 3.4.127-128).
>
> To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface
> at:
> http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
> and select "Join or leave the list"
>
> Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/
>
> To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface
> at:
> http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
> and select "Join or leave the list"
>
> Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/
>
>
> "If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable
> fiction" (_Twelfth Night_ 3.4.127-128).
>
> To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface
> at:
>      http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
> and select "Join or leave the list"
>
> Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/

To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at:
     http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
and select "Join or leave the list"

Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/

ATOM RSS1 RSS2