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ARCHIVES Home

ARCHIVES Home

ARCHIVES  June 2006, Week 3

ARCHIVES June 2006, Week 3

Subject:

Re: Archival Education

From:

"Maxwell, Daryl A" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Maxwell, Daryl A

Date:

Fri, 16 Jun 2006 15:50:18 -0700

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (196 lines)

I've been reading this thread with a great deal of interest and , like
others, had not planned on jumping into the discussion.  However, I felt
like I had to address the comments in this posting.

Archivist is, as several people have already pointed out, a professional
title.  Among other things necessary to call yourself a professional is to
have studied in the accepted fields of study and graduated with an advanced
degree.  There is NO substitution for this step.  No amount of experience,
reading, internships or attending workshops is a viable substitution.

Other professionals, Doctors, Lawyers, etc, require years of advanced
education to enter the profession, yet no one seems to question this.  In
addition, no ever claims "well, I've been working in a hospital for 15
years, so that makes me a Doctor."  Working in a hospital doesn't make you a
Doctor and working in an Archive DOES NOT make you an Archivist.  Only the
proper education makes you an Archivist.

I myself have BA & BS degrees in my areas of expertise, a MLIS with an
Archival Administration emphasis, and a certificate in Collections
Management, all of which have been invaluable to me in my career.

I'm actually pleased to hear that more companies/institutions are holding
out for degreed professionals because that indicates that they are beginning
to take our field seriously.  And isn't that what we all want?  In addition,
do you want to work for a company/institution that thinks that the work that
you do can be done by someone without the educational background?  All that
really indicates is a lack of value to what a professional brings to the
position.

Daryl A. Maxwell 
Collections Specialist
Walt Disney Feature Animation
Animation Research Library

phone -- 818-544-4163
tie-line -- 8223-4163
fax -- 818-544-4192




On 6/16/06 3:20 PM, "R L" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> I might be out of place for this discussion since I have not taken the MLS
> yet. But I think it's unfair that a lot of the jobs strictly require that
> applicants must have already received an MLS degree, because it blocks people
> like me who are hard-working and have gained valuable archival and
> preservation experiences from internships, workshops, and previous employment.
> I would like to work in a better organization and I believe I have what it
> takes. Unfortunately, there are so many jobs that I've already passed since
> I'm not qualified for it merely because I don't have the Master's diploma.
> Don't get me wrong, I am pro education and I am now thinking of getting the
> degree since it's a "must" in this field, but I just think it's a little
> unfair that people like me aren't given the chance to develop in prestigious
> places just because you don't have the proper degree.
> 
> I hope I'm wrong. Still trying.
> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: Archival Education
>> Date:         Fri, 16 Jun 2006 16:00:31 -0400
>> 
>> 
>> The question of education vs. experience raises (at least to me)
>> this question: How many of you (archivists, librarians, et al.) had
>> experience in archives and/or libraries BEFORE your formal training?
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Richard Cox <[log in to unmask]>
>>> Sent: Jun 16, 2006 3:40 PM
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: Archival Education
>>> 
>>> Beth Moser writes, ³I don't think that there's a right way to go
>>> about becoming an archivist -- whether it's from a graduate
>>> history perspective or a MLS perspective. This has long been a
>>> debate in the archival world.²  John Erdmann writes, ³I wonder,
>>> how did archivists and librarians ever got along before requiring
>>> advanced degrees and/or certifications?  Are the respective
>>> fields better for it?  I have talked to so many librarians who
>>> have told me that their experience in library school was
>>> virtually worthless.  Many have told me that the first job
>>> offered the best training.²  Erdmann, in a subsequent message,
>>> writes: ³Must that education and training come in the form of
>>> advanced degrees at expensive universities, or could it come from
>>> the within the work environment, study on one's own, and at
>>> conferences?²
>>> 
>>> There is a right way to become an archivist and not everything
>>> can be learned on the job.  There is a knowledge to our field (if
>>> there is not, then we are not a discipline) and there is a need
>>> for education (different from training).  As two recent observers
>>> about higher education have noted, ³To succeed in education is
>>> not to succeed in what one sets out to do, or even to succeed in
>>> doing whatever is within the realm of possibility; success means
>>> to succeed in doing something worth doing.² (James Engell and
>>> Anthony Dangerfield, Saving Higher Education in the Age of Money
>>> [Charlottesville: University of Virginia Press, 2005], p. 128]
>>> We need education, not merely apprenticeship, credentialing,
>>> practical information, etc., because the archival mission is
>>> important to society (and, actually, there is quite a range to
>>> salaries for such positions).
>>> 
>>> Leon Miller writes, ³In other words, your title, your degrees,
>>> where you got your training and experience, are all pretty much
>>> crap. The archival profession needs to do a far, far better job
>>> of making the point that regardless of someoneıs title, a person
>>> responsible for archival collections had damn well better be an
>>> archivist, had better have a thorough professional-level
>>> understanding of archival theory and practice (which, in the US
>>> today, usually means an MLS with a minimum of twelve semester
>>> credit hours in areas defined as core archival knowledge followed
>>> by archival certification within a year or two of graduation,
>>> although that is not quite yet the only route) and had better be
>>> able to apply archival theory and practice to their work.²  Yes,
>>> Leon is correct.  It is sad that those who complain about salary
>>> and recognition also are usually the ones who lament the need for
>>> real education.  Graduate archival education has changed quite a
>>> bit for the better over the past!
>>>  few de
>>> cades, and there are many programs far exceeding what Leon
>>> describes in his message.  Unfortunately, the profession
>>> generally seems ignorant of what this education represents and
>>> less than interested in arguing for it to be even better than it
>>> is.  No, you canıt learn all you need to know on the job or by
>>> reading quietly at home a few basic manuals.  Even to suggest
>>> this is to reflect why a stronger foundational education is
>>> needed.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Richard J. Cox
>>> Professor
>>> Department of Library and Information Sciences
>>> School of Information Sciences
>>> University of Pittsburgh
>>> Editor, Records & Information Management Report
>>> Pittsburgh, PA 15260
>>> Voice:  412-624-3245
>>> FAX:    412-648-7001
>>> e-mail: [log in to unmask]
>>> homepage: http://www2.sis.pitt.edu/%7Ercox/
>>> 
>>> "What we would like to do is change the world - to make it a
>>> little simpler for people to feed, clothe, and shelter themselves
>>> as God intended for them to do. And we can change the world: we
>>> can work for the oasis, the little cell of joy and peace in a
>>> harried world.  We can throw our pebble in the pond and be
>>> confident that its ever widening circle will reach around the
>>> world." - Dorothy Day A posting from the Archives & Archivists
>>> LISTSERV List sponsored by the Society of American Archivists,
>>> www.archivists.org.
>>> For the terms of participation, please refer to
>>> http://www.archivists.org/listservs/arch_listserv_terms.asp.
>>> 
>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]
>>>      In body of message:  SUB ARCHIVES firstname lastname
>>>                    *or*:  UNSUB ARCHIVES
>>> To post a message, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]
>>> 
>>> Or to do *anything* (and enjoy doing it!), use the web interface at
>>>     http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/archives.html
>>> 
>>> Problems?  Send e-mail to Robert F Schmidt <[log in to unmask]>
>> 
>> A posting from the Archives & Archivists LISTSERV List sponsored by
>> the Society of American Archivists, www.archivists.org.
>> For the terms of participation, please refer to
>> http://www.archivists.org/listservs/arch_listserv_terms.asp.
>> 
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]
>>        In body of message:  SUB ARCHIVES firstname lastname
>>                      *or*:  UNSUB ARCHIVES
>> To post a message, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]
>> 
>> Or to do *anything* (and enjoy doing it!), use the web interface at
>>       http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/archives.html
>> 
>> Problems?  Send e-mail to Robert F Schmidt <[log in to unmask]>
> 
>> 
> 

A posting from the Archives & Archivists LISTSERV List sponsored by the Society of American Archivists, www.archivists.org.
For the terms of participation, please refer to http://www.archivists.org/listservs/arch_listserv_terms.asp.

To subscribe or unsubscribe, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]
      In body of message:  SUB ARCHIVES firstname lastname
                    *or*:  UNSUB ARCHIVES
To post a message, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]

Or to do *anything* (and enjoy doing it!), use the web interface at
     http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/archives.html

Problems?  Send e-mail to Robert F Schmidt <[log in to unmask]>

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