R L writes, “I think it's unfair that a lot of the jobs strictly require that applicants must have already received an MLS degree, because it blocks people like me who are hard-working and have gained valuable archival and preservation experiences from internships, workshops, and previous employment. I would like to work in a better organization and I believe I have what it takes. Unfortunately, there are so many jobs that I've already passed since I'm not qualified for it merely because I don't have the Master's diploma. Don't get me wrong, I am pro education and I am now thinking of getting the degree since it's a "must" in this field, but I just think it's a little unfair that people like me aren't given the chance to develop in prestigious places just because you don't have the proper degree.”
Why is this “unfair”? The reason so many institutions require the MLIS is that this is where most substantial graduate archival education programs reside. Why is it unfair for any field to have standards? Well, partly, because society demands that professions with important mandates have people who are experts. Would it be unfair for someone to be accepted as a physician because they are a good hospital intern and believe they could function as a doctor? Being an archivist is not solely dependent on practice, and archival knowledge is not isolated to what can be learned as an apprentice.
R. L., after you go to a good graduate program, I suspect you will understand this a lot better. The good jobs you are looking for will come, but there are dues to pay and things to learn.
--
Richard J. Cox
Professor
Department of Library and Information Sciences
School of Information Sciences
University of Pittsburgh
Editor, Records & Information Management Report
Pittsburgh, PA 15260
Voice: 412-624-3245
FAX: 412-648-7001
e-mail: [log in to unmask]
homepage: http://www2.sis.pitt.edu/%7Ercox/
"What we would like to do is change the world - to make it a little simpler for people to feed, clothe, and shelter themselves as God intended for them to do. And we can change the world: we can work for the oasis, the little cell of joy and peace in a harried world. We can throw our pebble in the pond and be confident that its ever widening circle will reach around the world." - Dorothy Day
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: R L <[log in to unmask]>
> I might be out of place for this discussion since I have not taken the MLS yet.
> But I think it's unfair that a lot of the jobs strictly require that applicants
> must have already received an MLS degree, because it blocks people like me who
> are hard-working and have gained valuable archival and preservation experiences
> from internships, workshops, and previous employment. I would like to work in a
> better organization and I believe I have what it takes. Unfortunately, there are
> so many jobs that I've already passed since I'm not qualified for it merely
> because I don't have the Master's diploma. Don't get me wrong, I am pro
> education and I am now thinking of getting the degree since it's a "must" in
> this field, but I just think it's a little unfair that people like me aren't
> given the chance to develop in prestigious places just because you don't have
> the proper degree.
>
> I hope I'm wrong. Still trying.
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Re: Archival Education
> > Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2006 16:00:31 -0400
> >
> >
> > The question of education vs. experience raises (at least to me)
> > this question: How many of you (archivists, librarians, et al.) had
> > experience in archives and/or libraries BEFORE your formal training?
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Richard Cox <[log in to unmask]>
> > > Sent: Jun 16, 2006 3:40 PM
> > > To: [log in to unmask]
> > > Subject: Archival Education
> > >
> > > Beth Moser writes, “I don't think that there's a right way to go
> > > about becoming an archivist -- whether it's from a graduate
> > > history perspective or a MLS perspective. This has long been a
> > > debate in the archival world.” John Erdmann writes, “I wonder,
> > > how did archivists and librarians ever got along before requiring
> > > advanced degrees and/or certifications? Are the respective
> > > fields better for it? I have talked to so many librarians who
> > > have told me that their experience in library school was
> > > virtually worthless. Many have told me that the first job
> > > offered the best training.” Erdmann, in a subsequent message,
> > > writes: “Must that education and training come in the form of
> > > advanced degrees at expensive universities, or could it come from
> > > the within the work environment, study on one's own, and at
> > > conferences?”
> > >
> > > There is a right way to become an archivist and not everything
> > > can be learned on the job. There is a knowledge to our field (if
> > > there is not, then we are not a discipline) and there is a need
> > > for education (different from training). As two recent observers
> > > about higher education have noted, “To succeed in education is
> > > not to succeed in what one sets out to do, or even to succeed in
> > > doing whatever is within the realm of possibility; success means
> > > to succeed in doing something worth doing.” (James Engell and
> > > Anthony Dangerfield, Saving Higher Education in the Age of Money
> > > [Charlottesville: University of Virginia Press, 2005], p. 128]
> > > We need education, not merely apprenticeship, credentialing,
> > > practical information, etc., because the archival mission is
> > > important to society (and, actually, there is quite a range to
> > > salaries for such positions).
> > >
> > > Leon Miller writes, “In other words, your title, your degrees,
> > > where you got your training and experience, are all pretty much
> > > crap. The archival profession needs to do a far, far better job
> > > of making the point that regardless of someone’s title, a person
> > > responsible for archival collections had damn well better be an
> > > archivist, had better have a thorough professional-level
> > > understanding of archival theory and practice (which, in the US
> > > today, usually means an MLS with a minimum of twelve semester
> > > credit hours in areas defined as core archival knowledge followed
> > > by archival certification within a year or two of graduation,
> > > although that is not quite yet the only route) and had better be
> > > able to apply archival theory and practice to their work.” Yes,
> > > Leon is correct. It is sad that those who complain about salary
> > > and recognition also are usually the ones who lament the need for
> > > real education. Graduate archival education has changed quite a
> > > bit for the better over the past!
> > > few de
> > > cades, and there are many programs far exceeding what Leon
> > > describes in his message. Unfortunately, the profession
> > > generally seems ignorant of what this education represents and
> > > less than interested in arguing for it to be even better than it
> > > is. No, you can’t learn all you need to know on the job or by
> > > reading quietly at home a few basic manuals. Even to suggest
> > > this is to reflect why a stronger foundational education is
> > > needed.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Richard J. Cox
> > > Professor
> > > Department of Library and Information Sciences
> > > School of Information Sciences
> > > University of Pittsburgh
> > > Editor, Records & Information Management Report
> > > Pittsburgh, PA 15260
> > > Voice: 412-624-3245
> > > FAX: 412-648-7001
> > > e-mail: [log in to unmask]
> > > homepage: http://www2.sis.pitt.edu/%7Ercox/
> > >
> > > "What we would like to do is change the world - to make it a
> > > little simpler for people to feed, clothe, and shelter themselves
> > > as God intended for them to do. And we can change the world: we
> > > can work for the oasis, the little cell of joy and peace in a
> > > harried world. We can throw our pebble in the pond and be
> > > confident that its ever widening circle will reach around the
> > > world." - Dorothy Day A posting from the Archives & Archivists
> > > LISTSERV List sponsored by the Society of American Archivists,
> > > www.archivists.org.
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> > >
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> >
> > A posting from the Archives & Archivists LISTSERV List sponsored by
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>
>
> --
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> A posting from the Archives & Archivists LISTSERV List sponsored by the Society
> of American Archivists, www.archivists.org.
> For the terms of participation, please refer to
> http://www.archivists.org/listservs/arch_listserv_terms.asp.
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> Problems? Send e-mail to Robert F Schmidt <[log in to unmask]>
A posting from the Archives & Archivists LISTSERV List sponsored by the Society of American Archivists, www.archivists.org.
For the terms of participation, please refer to http://www.archivists.org/listservs/arch_listserv_terms.asp.
To subscribe or unsubscribe, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]
In body of message: SUB ARCHIVES firstname lastname
*or*: UNSUB ARCHIVES
To post a message, send e-mail to [log in to unmask]
Or to do *anything* (and enjoy doing it!), use the web interface at
http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/archives.html
Problems? Send e-mail to Robert F Schmidt <[log in to unmask]>