By golly! I don't believe this is happening! How can anybody think that
Martha is anything but right? Part-of-speech recognition is simple. Kolln &
Funk are lucid on the subject, as indeed are Quirk et al.

Sophie Johnson
at ENGLISH  GRAMMAR TUTOR
http://www.englishgrammartutor.com/
[log in to unmask]
----- Original Message -----
From: Martha Kolln <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 3:48 AM
Subject: Re: go fishing


> >Dear Bruce:
>
> I don't have to look it up in Quirk.  I can look it up in Kolln & Funk
> (Understanding English Grammar)--although I suspect I looked it up in
Quirk
> when I first wrote about this way back when.  Here are three examples of
> participles as adverbials (p. 122, 6th edition):
>
> My uncle made a fortune selling real estate.  (How?)
> The kids came running out of the house (How?  Where?)
> Betsy went swimming. (Where?)
>
> On the question of adverbial vs. adjectival infinitives, a good test is
the
> "in order to" test.  Most adverbial infinitives can be expanded with "in
> order": they answer the Why question.  Another test is movability:
> adverbials can often be moved; adjectivals usually can't.  In Kathleen's
> leather example--money to purchase leather--clearly the infinitive could
> open the sentence: That makes it adverbial.
>
> Martha
>
>
>
>
> Gordon,
> >
> >Maybe we ought to have Martha look it up in Quirk, _et.al._
> >
> >To me the phrase "go fishing" does indeed have the same force as "fish"
in the
> >generic sense.   Like "I go fishing on Fridays" for the same meaning as
"I
> >fish on Fridays".  "Fishing" is the gerund, as in "I like fishing" or "I
am
> >busy fishing."  I think of "go" as a verb that likes to take a gerund as
a
> >complement, _i.e._ a gerund in the form of an adverbial noun, if you
like.
> >(The Latins had a special noun form of the verb, a supine, that would
express
> >purpose.)  We may say, "I go swimming, jogging, sunning, and searching
for
> >shells on the beach in that order on Fridays." or " I swim, jog, sun, and
> >search for shells on the beach in that order on Fridays."
> >
> >Bruce Despain
> >
> >>>> [log in to unmask] 08/03/01 09:57AM >>>
> >This brings up a question we have been pondering = what is the function
of
> >'fishing' in "I go fishing"? It would seem the preferable solution would
be
> >"I fish."  Is the structure using 'go' as an apparent 'helping verb'
> >idiomatic; somewhat like "I have *got* a cold."? In "I go fishing," can
> >'fishing' somehow act like an adverb -- I go {where}; I cannot see it as
a
> >Direct Object, but maybe my sight is not what it used to be.
> >Gordon Carmichael
> >Central Texas College and Tarleton State University, Killeen, Texas
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Bruce Despain" <[log in to unmask]>
> >To: <[log in to unmask]>
> >Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 10:07 AM
> >Subject: Re: <no subject>
> >
> >
> >This discrepancy between Marylou and Sophie is in the area where
semantics
> >and syntax conflict.  I wonder about the following observations.
> >
> >In the sentence "I must go" are we tempted to think that "go" is the
object
> >of the verb "must"?  (We can ask, "What must you (do)?")  Historically,
we
> >could probably make a good argument that at some time it was so
perceived.
> >What about in the periphrastic version, "I have to go"?  Does the
infinitive
> >marked by "to" make it clear that maybe we have a complement (object) to
the
> >verb "have"?  Similarly with some other periphrastic versions of the
modals
> >(can - be able to; will - is going to, is about to) , where we have
> >complements to adjectives.  At one time this may have been the
perception.
> >But as with other formations of the verb, we now have modals as well as
> >helping verbs for the semantic categories established as tense and
aspect.
> >
> >Do the Australians now have a compound verb that works like modal
> >pariphrasis in "try to improve"?  Do they want to make "try" a
quasi-modal?
> >Perhaps the contrasting colloquial "try and improve", which seems to be
an
> >attempt to maintain the original syntactic independence, motivates the
new
> >syntactic analysis for "try".
> >
> >For me the object of "try" is an infinitive phrase serving as a noun
phrase
> >and the object of "improve" is a noun phrase.  With the phrase "try and
> >improve" the accomplishment is implied.  Here the verb "try" is either
> >intransitive or has an undersood object of "something", and the verb
> >"improve" shares the same subject, but has its own object.  The existence
> >and the contrast of these two collocations, seems to give "try to
improve"
> >the implication that the improvement will in fact occur.
> >
> >Bruce Despain
> >
> >>>> [log in to unmask] 08/03/01 05:55AM >>>
> >`Mary is trying to improve the condition of her house':
> >
> >There is no question in the above sentence of the verb's being anything
more
> >or less than `is trying to improve', nor of its object's being anything
> >other than `the condition of the house'.  `Mary', the subject of this
> >active-voice verb, is not acting upon `to improve the condition of her
> >house'; she is acting upon `the condition of her house'.
> >
> >Analysis of this sentence must note that it contains an active-voice
verb,
> >and that the characteristic of an active-voice verb is that its subject
acts
> >upon its object: Its subject names its actor, and its object the
acted-upon
> >To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web
interface at:
> >     http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
> >and select "Join or leave the list"
> >
> >Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/
>
> To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface
at:
>      http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
> and select "Join or leave the list"
>
> Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/

To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit the list's web interface at:
     http://listserv.muohio.edu/archives/ateg.html
and select "Join or leave the list"

Visit ATEG's web site at http://ateg.org/