Christopher,
You think this displays an "intellectual and civil attitude"? The only one who with a "had" problem seems to be you. This is because you don't understand the verb's tense and aspect - in English or other languages. A little fifth grade grammar would do you a lot of good.
As a matter of fact, I will be pleased and delighted if he will do as I asked. I hope he meant to volunteer, but I'll bet he won't do it, not because he won't but because he can't. He doesn't know what it is.
Do you know what it is?
The part about dropping out of school was only in reply to his jibe about fifth grade grammar. My rejoinder does not strike me as excessive, but if it offends you, I'm sorry.
What is it, Christopher? What is the past perfect? Our whole world is watching.
.brad.26july11.
From: Christopher Shull <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2011 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: intruding 'had's
I think sarcasm demeans the intellectual and civil attitude we should be taking here.
Chris
From:Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brad Johnston
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2011 5:19 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: intruding 'had's
Aaah, Eduard. How NICE of you to drop by. You are just what I need.
I had to drop out of school after the fourth grade to help support my family, so I never had the advantages you had.
It would be really, really helpful to me if you would please tell me what the past perfect is and give me some examples. Don't be too technical, just tell me what it is.
Many thanks.
.brad.26july11.
________________________________
From:Eduard Hanganu <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2011 9:24 AM
Subject: Re: intruding 'had's
Brad,
The only one who with a "had" problem seems to be you. This is because you don't understand the verb's tense and aspect - in English or other languages. A little fifth grade grammar would do you a lot of good.
Eduard
________________________________
From: "Brad Johnston" <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2011 6:15:27 AM
Subject: Re: intruding 'had's
Geoff wrote, So I was right that this was wrong but for the wrong reason - I <hadn't thought>didn'tthinkof that!
On the list or 'had' errors, 'had-for-did' is the fourth most frequent, after (1) 'had' in front of a past tense verb, (2) 'had been' where 'was' or 'were' belong, and (3) 'had' in front of an irregular past tense verb. 'Had-for-did' is a scrap, but a noticeable scrap. The bulk of the intruding 'had's put 'had' in front of regular and irregular past tense verbs, and that happens a lot.
My standard test is the first 21 pages of a novel. I note all the 'had's and that will be 50, 60, 80, 100 total. I subtract the correct usages of the past tense of 'have', and the past perfect, and the subjunctive. The error percentage thus derived runs from 45% to 90% (believe it or not).
I recently started a novel in which there are 166 'had's in the first 21 pages (a record) and the error rate is 77% (not a record). I wrote to the author and told him there are too many grammar errors for me to continue. He wrote back saying "Thank you very much. I'll talk to my copy editor about it". Authors tend to be defensive. Copy editors tend to be either defensive or dismissive, saying it's not their job. They make sure Pearl Harbor Day does not show as the 7th of January but otherwise the author can write whatever he or she wants to write.
James Patterson made $32 million in royalties in a recent year. Imagine a copy editor with enough of a death-wish to be willing to say, "Excuse me, Mr. Patterson, Sir, but you have a 'had' problem". Think that will ever happen? Not likely, is it?
.br.had.26july11.
~~~~~~~~
From:Geoffrey Layton <[log in to unmask]>
To:[log in to unmask]
Sent:Monday, July 25, 2011 7:51 PM
Subject:Re: intruding 'had's
So I was right that this was wrong but for the wrong reason - I hadn't thought of that!
Geoff Layton
________________________________
Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2011 16:46:07 -0700
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: intruding 'had's
To: [log in to unmask]
But you didn't run into a past perfect in the sample below. You ran into a 'had' in front of a past tense verb, which is an unfortunately common occurrence, even among professionals. There are otherwise-well-meaning people who insist on putting 'had's in front of past tense verbs, even irregular past tense verbs, which forces the irregular past participle, making them a tad harder to detect.
But thank you for thinking of me.
.brad.25july11.
________________________________
From:Geoffrey Layton <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2011 2:27 PM
Subject: Re: intruding 'had's
Brad,
When I read this, I immediately thought of you (as I do whenever I run into the past perfect)
As it happens, a team of animal behaviorists led by Jenny Ryon at Dalhousie University had explored this very question of canine's penchant for perfume in 1986. Their study wasn't with dogs—to the best of my knowledge, no controlled studies on scent-rubbing with domesticated dogs have ever been done—but with a very close relative instead: the wolf (Canis lupus).
Any comments
.
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