--- Linda Comerford <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> John and Len,
>
> Okay, I read my messages out of order when I asked
> what was wrong with the test questions and can now
> see that the way the explanations were written is
> the problem. I'm wondering where those answers
> occurred? If this is a test, surely the students
> didn't see them, so who did? Maybe the graders?
> Maybe the students did as post-test explanations? I
> guess I'm still confused.
>
> I do stand behind my original point, however, that
> teaching the correct way to use semicolons is useful
> for students in school and the business world alike.
>
> And I still find the nuances of punctuation
> fascinating!
>
> Linda
>
> "Crow, John T" wrote:
>
> > Hi Len,
> >
> > Paul's well-stated message speaks to this type of
> testing in general. In defense of the CAHSEE, it
> requires that students write an essay, so it isn't
> purely a collection of decontextualized sentences.
> However, the approach to the teaching of grammar
> inherent in these types of questions, combined with
> the misinformation that they contain raised my
> hackles:
> >
> > Item #1: The Alaskan rivers are clear and
> sparkling in summer however; they are frozen in
> winter.
> >
> > Solution: This is a run-on sentence No it isn't.
> two sentences run together without punctuation I
> guess the semi-colon doesn't count as punctuation.
> between them and needs to be fixed. "However" is a
> conjunction No it isn't. that needs to be set off by
> commas Not always. In fact, it won't be set off by
> commas when corrected. It would be possible to put
> in a period and a capital H on however. But that is
> not one of the choices. You dont join two complete
> thoughts that are equally important Importance
> relative to each other isn't an issue. Neither is
> "two complete thoughts." with commas or colons. You
> can most certainly join "two complete thoughts" with
> a colon EX: I go to Alaska every year for one
> reason: I love to fish for salmon.
> >
> > Item #2:
> >
> > The frightened pilot's face was ashen as he
> gingerly lowered the plane onto the Smiths' private
> __________ that time was running out for his ailing
> friend.
> >
> > A. runway: he knew
> >
> > B. runway, he knew
> >
> > C. runway. He knew
> >
> > D. runway but he knew
> >
> > There are two perfectly acceptable answers here:
> A and C. I can also construe a very reasonable
> context that would make D acceptable.
> >
> > Solutions: Read this one out loud, inserting the
> missing words. Reading out loud won't help at all.
> In spoken English, there is no difference between
> sentence boundaries and clausal boundaries, so
> students won't "hear" anything wrong with any of the
> resulting sentences. How many sentences do you have?
> Do you have one complete thought or two complete
> thoughts? Here we go with "complete thoughts" again.
> This is a very squishy concept--I can count several
> "complete thoughts" here. How do you end a
> sentence? How do you begin a new sentence? You know
> this, dont you? Only one of these answers includes
> a period and a capital letter.
> >
> > This post is already long enough, so I will end
> here. Contact me off the listserv if you want to
> continue this discussion--I could go on and on . . .
> .
> >
> > John
> > ([log in to unmask])
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Assembly for the Teaching of English Grammar
> on behalf of Len Wyatt
> > Sent: Wed 8/18/2004 3:11 AM
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Cc:
> > Subject: Re: CAHSEE
> >
> > Could you please explain to me further
> what is wrong with the questions? I think I am
> missing something. This is the kind of question
> (with a slight variation in the format) that my
> students frequently face on the BC Provincial Exams.
> >
> > Len Wyatt
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Assembly for the Teaching of English
> Grammar
> > [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf
> Of Crow, John T
> > Sent: August 17, 2004 2:12 PM
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: CAHSEE
> >
> >
> > California has passed a law requiring high
> school students pass a standardized exam in order to
> graduate--the CAlifornia High School Exit Exam
> (CAHSEE). Here are two seriously flawed sample
> questions from the study guide for the so-called
> Writing Conventions Strand
> (http://www.cde.ca.gov/ta/tg/hs/elaguide.asp). Need
> I say more??
> >
> > John
> >
> > Released CAHSEE question
> >
> > The Alaskan rivers are clear and sparkling
> in summer however; they are frozen in winter.
> >
> > A. in summer, however they are frozen in
> winter.
> >
> > B. in summer; however, they are frozen in
> winter.
> >
> > C. in summer: however they are frozen in
> winter.
> >
> > D. Leave as is.
> >
> > Solution
> >
> > This is a run-on sentencetwo sentences run
> together without punctuation between themand needs
> to be fixed. "However" is a conjunction that needs
> to be set off by commas. It would be possible to put
> in a period and a capital H on however. But that is
> not one of the choices. You dont join two complete
> thoughts that are equally important with commas or
> colons. The preceding sentence joins two complete
> thoughts that could be separated into two sentences.
> What punctuation mark joins the two thoughts into
> one sentence? A semicolon joins them. The correct
> answer is B. (WC 10.1.1)
> >
> > Released CAHSEE question
> >
> > The frightened pilot's face was ashen as
> he gingerly lowered the plane onto the Smiths'
> private __________ that time was running out for his
> ailing friend.
> >
> > A. runway: he knew
> >
> > B. runway, he knew
> >
> > C. runway. He knew
> >
> > D. runway but he knew
> >
> > Solution
> >
> > Read this one out loud, inserting the
> missing words. How many sentences do you have? Do
> you have one complete thought or two complete
> thoughts? How do you end a sentence? How do you
> begin a new sentence? You know this, dont you? Only
> one of these answers includes a period and a capital
> letter. The correct answer is C. (WC 10.1.1)
> >
> > To join or leave this LISTSERV list,
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> >
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> > and select "Join or leave the list"
> >
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> >
>
> To join or leave this LISTSERV list, please visit
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>
Your D answer is not acceptable; that would be a run
on in my book. Sorry. I agree, however, with the A and C
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